Discussion :: Syllogism - Syllogism 1 (Q.No.2)
In each of the following questions two statements are given and these statements are followed by two conclusions numbered (1) and (2). You have to take the given two statements to be true even if they seem to be at variance from commonly known facts. Read the conclusions and then decide which of the given conclusions logically follows from the two given statements, disregarding commonly known facts.
- (A) If only (1) conclusion follows
- (B) If only (2) conclusion follows
- (C) If either (1) or (2) follows
- (D) If neither (1) nor (2) follows and
- (E) If both (1) and (2) follow.
|Parth said: (Nov 24, 2010)|
|Can anyone please explain me this question? I didn't get.|
|Prachi said: (Jan 11, 2011)|
all x=all y (1)
all y=all z (2)
so,all x=all z
all harmoniums are flutes
|Bal;U said: (Jan 14, 2011)|
|I think ans is d.
Because from your point of you all the haromo are fluts.
There should be some instruments.
|Ram said: (Jan 26, 2011)|
|Thanx to prachi. She made a simple way to solve the problem.|
|Ratnakar said: (Jul 21, 2011)|
|All X are Y
All Y are Z
All X are Z
some Z are X
|Sneha said: (Sep 14, 2011)|
|Acoording to you ans may be B also na.
We can make z=x.
|Bhaskar said: (Nov 15, 2011)|
|I think answer would be E, because .All the instruments are flutes-> Right. But, Why not this sentence All the flutes are instruments is right?|
|Gokila said: (Nov 16, 2011)|
|Very good explanation prachi;-).|
|Kruthika said: (Dec 14, 2011)|
|Can anyone tell me about that diagram drawn under solution ?|
|Ravinder Kumar said: (Dec 19, 2011)|
|By Raval notations HH -I II -F so HH - F follows|
|Neeta said: (Dec 31, 2011)|
|Please explain rules of Raval notations.|
|Sravanthi said: (Jan 1, 2012)|
|I didn't understand ravinder kumar answer. Could you pleas explain that ?|
|Manoj Kumar said: (Jan 4, 2012)|
|Raval's notation is new simplest and quickest way to solve syllogism problems at a glance.Very soon you will find that everyone is applying Raval's method for syllogism problems.|
|Rupa said: (May 4, 2012)|
|I think answer is E. Can any one explain how statement1 dosen't follows?|
|Jayesh said: (Jun 7, 2012)|
|Answer will be (b)
Since it is satisfying all five rules of syllogism
1)A syllogism must contain exactly three terms, each of which is used in the same sense.
2)The middle term must be distributed in at least one premise.
3) If MAJOR or MINOR term is distributed in the conclusion, then it must be distributed in the premises.
4) No syllogism can have two negative premises.
5) If either premise is negative, the conclusion must be negative.
|Manoj Kumar said: (Jul 17, 2013)|
|Raval's notation is new simplest and quickest way to solve syllogism problems at a glance. Search 'raval notations at philpapers' in google and find complete new and simple approach published at University of London.|
|Avinash said: (Feb 27, 2014)|
|I just can't get the logic behind these kind of questions. Can anyone please help me with the simplest logic ?|
|Vijaya said: (Apr 11, 2014)|
|If all the instruments are flutes then why can't all the flutes are instruments.|
|Deshna Jain said: (Apr 21, 2014)|
|I agree with @Vijaya why can't it be all the flutes are instruments?|
|Trisaiteja said: (May 17, 2014)|
|Don't follow mathematical rules just follow the rules of the syllogism.|
|Dhanu said: (May 29, 2014)|
|The answer is A. Because second statement is invalid. All fruits are harmoniums but not all harmonium are fruits.|
|Vikash said: (Jul 17, 2014)|
|I think that there is also an another case in which all the instruments are flute from venn diagram then why you leave this condition.|
|Aniket said: (Sep 6, 2014)|
|As per Prachi's solution its B. But when you simply think. Answer will be A.|
|Mylez said: (Sep 26, 2014)|
|It follows the BARBARA syllogism form or AAA-1 That's why B is the answer.|
|Sonia said: (Nov 15, 2014)|
|Can anybody tell me the trick to solve syllogism.|
|Ravinder Kumar said: (Dec 23, 2014)|
|Go through transformed raval notations and you will solve syllogism problems at a glance without any paperwork.
Raval notations is a latest method to solve syllogism problems at a glance, say 5-7 seconds.
|Ram said: (Mar 5, 2015)|
|See inner (means down to up) to outer all + some both are follows. But outer (means up to down) only follows some.|
|Uday S said: (Mar 31, 2015)|
|Excellent explanation @Prachi, you are right. Its very simple as if A=B, B=C.
Then C should always be equal to A, and applying same concept here there are flutes which are not harmoniums but all harmoniums are flutes for true.
|Bharat said: (May 7, 2015)|
I don't think so. All A are B it also means some B are A.
So another implication is also possible for the question.
Statements: All the harmoniums are instruments. All the instruments are flutes.
For statement 1 the implication would be:
Some instruments are harmonium.
So some harmoniums are not flutes.
So no conclusion follows.
Please suggest if any reply is there.
|Vinoth said: (May 27, 2015)|
|Hi @Mr. Ravinder kumar/@Mr. Jayesh.
Could you please explain the raval notations in detail?
It will be very helpful to me. Thanks in advance.
|Ravinder Kumar said: (Jun 13, 2015)|
Here it is not possible to explain Raval notations due to space restrictions. You may search for Raval notations at google.
|Jacky said: (Aug 6, 2015)|
|@Prachi your second part is wrong I guess. As you have taken harmonium as z n flutes as x. Therefore z=x. Not all y= all z.
As per the second part. If my concept is wrong then please explain it to me.
|Kachwal Jyothi Sharma said: (Aug 18, 2015)|
|There are some conditions in syllogism.
For ALL = 100, 50.
SOME = 50, 50.
NO = 100, 100.
In conclusion the weight cannot be increased than statement, it can be decreased but cannot be increased, So conclusion 1 is wrong.
And one more to be remember if statement consist +ve, +ve then conclusion must be +ve.
If statement consist +ve, -ve then conclusion must be -ve. If statement consist -ve, -ve then No conclusion.
|Akshit said: (Oct 22, 2015)|
|Let flutes be x, harmonium be y and instruments be z.
Therefore all y = z, all z = x.
Hence, all the harmoniums are flutes.
|Sai Teja said: (Nov 25, 2015)|
Can you explain the short cut in syllogism?
|Parvathy said: (May 10, 2016)|
|A statement can convert into A2 statement to S2 statement. So can convert into all flutes are harmoniums.
Then both 1 and 2 follows.
|Najmul Haque said: (May 21, 2016)|
|Answer should be d.
All the harmonium= all the instrument.
All the instrument = all the flute.
So both the statement is true.
All the flutes are instruments.
All the harmoniums are flutes.
|Ashish said: (Aug 29, 2016)|
|Even I also found the answer to be (d).|
|Diya said: (Aug 31, 2016)|
|Even I have a doubt why it is not conclusion one?|
|Venkatesh said: (Oct 5, 2016)|
|As per my knowledge, my answer is E. Can you please explain how it is wrong?|
|Rachana said: (Oct 6, 2016)|
|The answer is option D.|
|Salil said: (Oct 12, 2016)|
|What is the numbering (i.e 100 50) for SOME NOT?|
|Munnangi.Devi said: (Nov 27, 2016)|
|Why not it is D? I assure it is option D.|
|Haider said: (Jan 19, 2017)|
Your solving method is very fantastic. Thanks.
If you have any shortcut method for setting arrangement.
Please help me.
|Parag said: (May 10, 2017)|
|Why not option E?|
|Priyabishnu033 said: (Jun 2, 2017)|
|I am not understanding it. So please anyone explain me.|
|Utkarsh said: (Aug 28, 2017)|
|The answer must be E.|
|Vishnu said: (Sep 3, 2017)|
|Both the conclusion are true through possible diagram.|
|Neil said: (Sep 14, 2017)|
|According to the Directions to Solve:
Read the conclusions and then decide which of the given conclusions logically follows from the two given statements, "disregarding commonly known facts".
So, if we just consider the 2 given statements:
All the harmoniums are instruments.
All the instruments are flutes (Conclusion 1).
which means, All the harmoniums are flutes (Conclusion 2).
So, Both Conclusions should be correct.
|Sailu said: (Oct 13, 2017)|
|Please anyone can explain this?|
|Chetan said: (Nov 16, 2017)|
|Short method is 100 & 50 method.
By Ashwin sir (IAS aspirant).
|Anish said: (Nov 20, 2017)|
|I think the answer is E.
The diagram in explanation shows only one situation that harmoniums are making a portion of instruments. But as per set theory, the complete set is also a subset of the given set. It can also be true that if all harmoniums are instruments, all instruments are also harmonium. Similarly in the second sentence.
In such case, option E is the answer.
|Nad said: (Jan 12, 2018)|
|Ans is E I think.|
|Narvinder said: (Feb 19, 2018)|
|I think it is E.|
|Jahnavi said: (Apr 28, 2018)|
|Yes! the answer must be E.|
|Shubhangi S said: (Jul 28, 2018)|
|E is the correct option.|
|Arpan said: (Sep 4, 2018)|
|According to me, E is the correct answer.|
|Asif said: (Sep 13, 2018)|
|Very easy Simple trick for inner and outer circle problem.
If we move from inner to outer circle two conclusions are correct (all+some), whereas if we move from outer to inner only (some) conclusion is correct.
All flutes are instruments (we are moving from outer to inner so only "some" conclusion correct), all harmonious are flute (we are moving from inner to outer hence in conclusion wherever "all and some come that is correct).
|Hemil Sutariya said: (Sep 23, 2018)|
It says all the instruments (A) are flutes (B). But all the flutes (B) may not be instruments (A).
Basically flutes (B) includes all instruments (A) but instruments (A) does not includes all flutes (B).
|Hanuman said: (Jul 3, 2019)|
Can you explain Raval Notations with example?
|Ravinder said: (Jul 19, 2019)|
Statements (both premises and conclusions) are represented as follows: Statement Notation
a) All S are P, SS-P
b) Some S are P, S-P
c) Some S are not P, S / PP
d) No S is P, SS / PP
1) Conclusions are reached by connecting Notations. Two notations can be linked only through common linking terms. When the common linking term multiplies (becomes double from single), divides (becomes single from double) or remains double then the conclusion is arrived between terminal terms.
2) If both statements linked are having " signs, resulting conclusion carries " sign
3) Whenever statements having " and / signs are linked, resulting conclusion carries / sign.
4) Statement having / sign cannot be linked with another statement having / sign to derive any conclusion.
For this question:
By Raval notations HH -I II -F so HH - F follows.
|Ayush said: (Aug 12, 2019)|
|Set of instruments and set of flute can also overlap so answer might be (d).|
|Abhishek said: (Oct 18, 2019)|
|Conclusion and statement are not equal. If both are same. There is no concept of conclusion. Remember one think conclusion means we get some thing from statement. So conclusion is becomes statement. What you learn from conclusion. That's why option 1 is wrong.|
|Hanuman said: (Nov 10, 2019)|
|@Ravinder, I learned Raval Notations, this is simple, fast and accurate. By Raval notations HH -I II -F , since common term (I) multiplies, so HH - F follows. Can Raval Notations can solve possibility type questions too, last time I was not able to crack IBPS Exam by two marks and I feel with knowledge of Raval Notations, I will have around 4 minutes extra|
|Prakash said: (Feb 8, 2020)|
|Instead of following this diagrammatic representation, if we follow the syllogism rules basis it would be easier and we can solve it in less than minute.|
|Shivam said: (Sep 8, 2020)|
|Nice answer, thanks all.|
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